Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby pinkname » Tue Jan 21, 2014 6:38 pm

Thanks for the answer!

I'm quite sure you know better the technicals than me. I was dealing with these sort of issues many years ago, but I'm sure there were always reasons behind limitations in competitions. Maybe I can try looking everything up (seems quite hopeless) to see what caused troubles and what can be safely ignored (eg. I always hated the simpleitems rule, I won't miss it :p).

I don't remember either what was the problem with 333 fps, but i do remember the picimp and rmse things: trees. Getting rid of branches is an advantage you surely want to have (unrelated to beach, but important eg. on ice). Anyhow, in the 1.33 years I was used to very low graphics details, but I'm not very sure most ppl want those years to come back.

I didn't know that max rate is not pb limited, nor what happens when using ultra low timenudge. Gamma and intensity settings are not very important imo, uifullscreen is enabled everywhere, so maybe it's just much ado about nothing. I'll think about.

J.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby 'L0, » Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:17 pm

There's no point reinventing warm water as wolfX had more or less all abusive cvars limited - shadows, maxpackets min 30, snaps, rate, timenudge completely removed, rmse, picmip, intensity and a whole lot more..so it's just a matter of porting it.

If going down this route then some of cvars can be limited by mod but render cvars checks and some others have to be set engine wise. A valid alternative is also engine wise cvar checking that imitates PB. I wrote a prototype a while ago (should be somewhere in one of repo's branches). While it worked, it was never really thoroughly tested against exploits.

Also various new features would also limit exploits - fixed physics works great for fps > 125 exploit etc.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby =WFL= TheSgtBilko » Wed Jan 22, 2014 6:41 pm

Great news, I applaud this!

I thought the ioRtCW project was abandonned, thanks for proving me wrong!

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby pinkname » Thu Jan 23, 2014 2:32 pm

'L0, wrote:There's no point reinventing warm water as wolfX had more or less all abusive cvars limited - shadows, maxpackets min 30, snaps, rate, timenudge completely removed, rmse, picmip, intensity and a whole lot more..so it's just a matter of porting it.

If going down this route then some of cvars can be limited by mod but render cvars checks and some others have to be set engine wise. A valid alternative is also engine wise cvar checking that imitates PB. I wrote a prototype a while ago (should be somewhere in one of repo's branches). While it worked, it was never really thoroughly tested against exploits.

Also various new features would also limit exploits - fixed physics works great for fps > 125 exploit etc.


Well yes, this is getting deeper than we could discuss it here, my lack of knowledge starts to show.

Anyway, should I think this is the time to start rly thinking about working on new assets? Hmm, I might create a nice crate one day. What about a nice pink one? ;)

J.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby 'L0, » Thu Jan 23, 2014 3:28 pm

I already ported weapons and other things just for the fun of it but textures were messed up and I was too lazy to bother as I have little if any interest in modelling aspect.

There should be assimp converter somewhere. It supports conversion to or from various formats just ain't sure if it's on import or export side. Alternative is too simply port assimp to io and replace all outdated modelling handling crap..tho needs a c wrapper since assimp is in c++.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby pinkname » Thu Jan 23, 2014 4:07 pm

'L0, wrote:I already ported weapons and other things


What do you mean by porting? :o Sortof copying/converting models into new paks? If so, what is that good for? Arrgh, I don't understand, pls enlighten me :)

J.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby 'L0, » Thu Jan 23, 2014 5:07 pm

http://assimp.sourceforge.net/

It's probably not something artists would be directly interested in but it does aid since it replaces the need for outdated plugins and working on outdated software..one can easily work on latest Maya, Max, Collada, Blender etc...and simply parse it thru converter. Only thing I'm not sure is, if it only exports meshes and imports bunch of formats or is it vice versa. Albeit implementation of mesh format or alike should be trivial for the most of the part.

Ow and it has a C api.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby pinkname » Thu Jan 23, 2014 6:02 pm

Yes, I checked it out ofc, I just don't see why it is needed for us. Why do we need to convert anything? :o Mkay, it can be useful when doing some dirty copy stuff, but I don't see why you had to convert existing models for wolfx (or whatever).

(yet another converter can be useful anytime eg. I'm always looking for a better dicom parser than I have - sadly it isn't one :X)

(and I've never ever seen a converter doing textures properly, at least faces always got inverted :D)

(and I still have to do my homework about q3 mesh/texture formats)

J.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby 'L0, » Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:48 am

Eh, you misunderstood. It was a poor choice of words on my end (was tired and multitasking).

Assimp is not a converter of models, it's a model loader. Adding assimp to engine would replace md3, iqm or md5 model format and also fix the art pipeline because i.e. when I ported models to wolfX I used some outdated exporter on outdated software (Max - 2009 if I recall correctly) with no support and severely lacking documentation. Assimp offers export from most of modern apps into unified format which in essence fixes the art pipe so you can work on latest Maya, Max, Blender etc.. and simply import assets on the fly (thru really simple converting process) to a game.

Basically it solves the art pipeline problem as well as it supports skeletal animations and other things.
I'm on coffee atm but hopefully makes more sense now. =)

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby pinkname » Fri Jan 24, 2014 7:19 am

Aaaa, I think I'm starting to understand :))

If I'm right you forgot to mention, that you're talking about a brand new model storage/parse system (not md3 based). Uhh, this is a field I don't know much about, last time I touched anything like this was in 1996, some time had passed since then :D Those times I used Inventor, Alias Wavefront (nowadays called Maya), and we had our own text based system for storing model data, only textures were included in binary form (all on SGI), animations were hardcoded.

As I see you tried assimp as a parser that would bring many new possibilities in addition to making the modeling work much less painful.

Am I right now, or am I just misunderstanding everything again? :DDd

(And ofc I still know quite nothing about how the q3/iortcw/wolfx engine is dealing with meshes/poligons/textures/shading whatever.)

J.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby 'L0, » Fri Jan 24, 2014 7:28 am

Yep you got it now. It would basically replace outdated model format and on top of it, add more modern model features (e.g. skeletal animations) and most of all, ability to export from most of new apps. That would make it easier for artist to simply work in app of their choice and once done simply export (convert) to game format thru a simple process.

Comparing this to current process where artist has to hunt down old exporters and work on outdated software with little or no documentation, I think it's a straight win-win situation.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby pinkname » Fri Jan 24, 2014 8:04 am

From a modeler aspect it sounds super! (editing vertex data in text files is not very 2014ish)

If one just has to create poligons/ncurves/normals and UVW mapping for textures and click on save... well, that sounds pretty good. In my experience however no tools are perfect when you start using them, a solid workflow have to be implemented. Nowadays I'm dealing with medical imaging mostly and it's a pain. Every format has it's versions, subversions (not well documented ofc :d) and I always have to experiment what tools work with what.

I'd try Blender first (Blender game platform was a great idea 10 yrs ago) and how assimp deals with stuff exported from it. Now I'm quite busy, but in a couple weeks I'll have some time to build something for experimenting.

J.

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby murkey » Sat Feb 22, 2014 7:07 pm

Is it possible to remove blood with the client on shrubmod? would be awesome

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby h2o » Sat Feb 22, 2014 7:56 pm

Doesnt work for me :X

It says: VM_Create on UI failed. Copy console log to clipboard?

It happens to multiplayer only tho..

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Re: Wolf 1.42 (aka iortcw) released!

Postby Casey » Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:36 pm

Is there anyway to give it shuddering unplayable lag?

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