The idea behind all this..

[S.Shooter]

...is to make it somewhat more fair for ALL players on the server.
I'll try it to make it short but it will be a lot to read. Try to understand. Open your eyes and think outside the box.

First:
I thought the idea behind the ecg server beeing unlagged is to make all players, no matter ping, a decent chance to play and hit the enemy?
At least, this i assume.

Second:
With all this uber cvars allowed on the server, my theory is that it lags the server too much when people are using them. The graphics engine chokes. (more of that down the text) Hence forcing players to change thier settings even more, giving more lag and less reg.
I've been playing on this server for litterally a year(s) in gametime, everyday, all day long. And i noticed the more ppl are upgrading their computers the more they want to try out better fps etc.(beacuse its allowed)
Better internet connections and better computers should make a smoother gameplay for all, not the opposite. And not everybody needs to have fps higher then 125 to make the server lag. It needs only a few to make the engine choke, thus favoring those guys doing it.
See it's a moment22 of bad tweaking.



So.. to back up my theory i talked to Man-at-arms. And he have now tried the new settings on the server. (creds to MAA for testing, even tho he is really sceptic about it)
And many players saying they now have better registration and less lag and fps drops now.
That's great! That's the whole point. Suddenly we now have a chance to frag those leet players, without having to put nudge on, destroying the smooth view nudge 0 gives with unlag.
"Sad" part is, those less skilled players (or those with no tweaks) are actually harder to kill now because they now have bullets that register a little better. But hey, isn't that more fair for all, isn't that more FUN!? ^^

[S.Shooter]

So here we go for some explanations, i'm sure others can fill in the parts i missed or are wrong about


Unlag:
In short, unlag makes you hit where you aim at. Regardless of ping, you hit IF you aim on, or slightly infront of the enemy. Like if you where playing on a LAN.
So if you were spot on the enemy when you pull the trigger, the unlag calculates back in time to see if you should had hit. And if you did, you'll get the hit.
That's why some ppl think they get shot around a corner when they flee the scene and think they are safe. Because the higher pinged guy DID see you and shot and hit where HE saw you. The unlag here gives the correct hit despite the ping.
With no unlag, you'd probably missed the shot.


Timenudge:
Timenudge virtually lower the ping giving *harder* bullets because with lower ping you hit better. But as Arachnyd explained in the other tread, it also gives less accurate bullets and a warpier look on the enemies. From round -20 and up.
Example. this 150pinger have 0 nudge he unloads a clip into a lower ping guy with some nudge. He hear the hitsound (if it's on) telling him he hits 10-15 bullets before and if he gets the frag. But rtcw needs max of 8 bullets to make a frag!
Then he put, lets say -20 nudge on, goes to same position as he was earlier. Shoots the same guy and hey, this time it took less bullets to get the frag. It also means he can shoot straight on the enemy model, instead of leading the shots to compensate for higher ping.
But wait, wasn't that the idea of the unlag, to be able to shoot straight on instead of leading the shots or put nudge on?

Yes Warleagues allows timenudge -10 in matches, but that is on OSP servers with no unlag! And using -10 is more of a personal taste of how you aim. Straight on, or some leading of the shots.
Thegamecat put it well - "Thing is timenudge is one of those things that you don't need if no-one else is using it."



r_depthbits:
This one i never knew about, untill i saw all this ppl geting kicked for it. So i searched around, and oh my what do i found out about it.
Arachnyd says its only for colors. No it's not. This one is very exploitable.


I'm not sure if it the picture can be seen orderly so here's the direct link.
http://www.tardivo.de/sniperbugge8.gif
Then klick on the picture to make it bigger so you can read it too.

It cleary shows how this setting can be used as a wallhack. And the reason why they tried this is here:
http://74.125.77.132/search?q=cache:Gb3NlVbinx0J:www.pbbans.com/forums/print.html%26client%3Dwordr%26f%3D334%26t%3D28199+rtcw+r_depthbits+wallhack&cd=1&hl=sv&ct=clnk&gl=se&client=firefox-a
It's from PBbans.

[S.Shooter]

FPS higher then 125:
1#
I here qoute Fozzer from the PBbans staff.

pb_sv_cvar com_maxfps in 43 125
enforcing a maximum of 125 fps relates to the quake 3 engine and its “magical" fps values. At 333fps the engine can't cope with the amount of commands sent by client, this seems to cause the hitboxes to lag behind the player model making it very hard to hit them, the engine simply chokes.

I have emailed Godfragger, webmaster at the Warleagues site. To see if he can get hold of the proof they made a few years back. With screenshots showing the hitboxes clearly lagging behind the enemy model. (the old WL forums got hacked so they started over with a new site)

[S.Shooter]

2#
With a FPS double or way higher then your mouse input rate, you get very little or no bulletspread at all when turning fast.
Ex: The usb port have a default of 125Mhz, so if you set fps to lets say 250fps. You will have no bulletspread when turning. ALSO, it makes you much more quite. You don't hear all footsteps just every other 2 or so.
I tried this last week, and yes. That is what happens.
http://bani.anime.net/banimod/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5579
This link is for ET, but it works the same. There's way more to read if searching.

So here, 2 major points of why we should have a cap of 125fps on the server.
Well at least what i think. I'm not the Man.

Rate:
I saw people getting kicked for rate 5000 yesterday. Isn't rate 5000 default for rtcw?
People gotta be able to play the game out of the box.


Ok enough for now.
Let the rant begin.

[SavageParrot Profile]

Sounds good to me. The more level the playing field the better really.

[S.Shooter]

Hmm yeah, the question is wether to have a more strict server with a more fair gaming experience for all, with hopefully less lag and better reg. Or a loose server like it has been in the past. Which is cool that too.

I have no(less then many) problem with a loose server. Due to a decent computer.

But for the fairness for all.
In life. I don't like when a few get advantage for the cost of many others.

[Sorry Profile]

Yea shoot sound like a fair deal after reading the explanation. People are complaining (myself too included) because the game has changed a little. Its so much better now being able to hit people that once were impossible to hit. Even the playing field and Thanks shoot and MAA for helping us high pingers play better

[thegamecat Profile]

Good job for the explanations Shooter and thanks MAA for trying this out. Props to all for adjusting as well.

[weezy Profile]

I just finished playing on the server, gotta say my acc went up. I like a more strict server setting to even the field, I saw ppl getting kicked for that 333 fps nonsense. I'm not a fan when I fire first, they fire second and they run out of ammo before I do on a full clip.

I found myself shooting at the wall a couple of times because of that depthbits exploit, didn't realize it was a setting thought it was server/grahic settings. However as a user, its only able to be used with a sniper rifle not in smg circumstance.

[S.Shooter]

I found myself shooting at the wall a couple of times because of that depthbits exploit, didn't realize it was a setting thought it was server/grahic settings. However as a user, its only able to be used with a sniper rifle not in smg circumstance.

If it's only for sniper and not smg, how come you found yourself shooting at the wall? I don't get it, please explain further. Cus i never tried the depthbits thing.


-------------------------------------------------------------------


Well, my idea seems to work, the server feels better atm.
And it's PROBABLY MAINLY because of the fps caps.
But ok, let us try some timenudge -10 or max -20. To see if there's a difference. Or just put it back to as it was before.
Only thing, many lowpingers WILL use it, so there we are again, forcing us to use it too.

I was told i was wrong in this matter, and perhaps, i might be. It's an IDEA.
Still it does feels better.

What i want is a smoother server with better reg.

So perhaps we only need the fps cap and little less timenudge.
(for all to still hit reasonable)

Remember, this is a TEST for a week MAA said.

Now go out there and frag.

[weezy Profile]

IE when axis are right against beach wall, they will show. Its indistinguishable whether the axis is out on the beach infront of the wall or behind the wall. And because I see the axis I just shoot, I realize after the 1st or second shot he is behind the wall. I can see his location but can't really do anything else, once he is no longer pressed against the wall.

Same thing when they are behind a wall, in upper/lower - base/bunker their gun is poking out. To me it seems that the axis is sniping in plain sight and I have a clear shot, but in reality he is behind the wall protected.

Perhaps it is also sniper zoom settings, because at certain zoom settings I am able to see an enemy behind the wall, but with a different setting they disappear. I can give you the config I use so you can look over certain settings if you like; the player I got it from was a sniping expert, and now I realize why...

[S.Shooter]

Yeah i bet why he was good.
And i also understand why i get killed with a nade so many times hugging the wall as allieds, no matter where i stand. It really have felt like they know i'm there.
That would prolly be a gonner now tho.

[thegamecat Profile]

Yeah i bet why he was good.
And i also understand why i get killed with a nade so many times hugging the wall as allieds, no matter where i stand. It really have felt like they know i'm there.
That would prolly be a gonner now tho.

Well no, it's not that prevalent in maps - there are only a few places where that would occur. The main beach wall for example would not allow you to see anyone and iirc only a few spots like the beach side of the radio room spawn.

[thegamecat Profile]

Wow, I've played for about 30 minutes and please can we keep the tn at zero - I've not had any wierd shit once just primo performance. If we've got anti-lag it's doing its job and tn is clearly not necessary.

[MAN-AT-ARMS]

Couple of notes on this:

You can keep timenudge at 0 without having to enforce it by Punkbuster. The range it was set to previously was fine and not exploitable. The players who had timenudge at 0 previous to this would not have had any problem in the first place. The only people who say it is smoother and more accurate now are the idiots who up until now thought they needed timenudge when they really didnt.

What the screenshot posted about the r_depthbits above is not what you would generally see with that setting. It makes it look more exploitable than it really is. This would highly depend on position of the sniper, the enemy and the zoom. The server has kicked innocent players (who probably have no clue about this) approximately 175 times since yesterday for this setting alone. Is it worth it? Probably not. Especially not when youre trying to keep players playing this game and coming back to the server.

The 333fps theory above about hitboxes and rate of fire is bunk. Don't believe everything you read on the various forums. I talked to some of the developers who know the engine better than anyone and they agree that this is not the case. That said, I'll leave the cap at 125 if for no other reason than psychological reasons because it really makes no difference. One less excuse to use for players who are getting rolled.

The only cvar checks that I changed that would actually make any difference at all were rate (from 5000 on the low end to 15000) and cl_maxpackets (from 15 on the low end to 30)


I have to say though, the best tweak you can make is to play smart. Stop blaming others' configs/settings when you don't.