Unfairenheit 9/11

by **Folic_Acid** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 5:58 pm

Originally posted by JimmyTango
Yeah, comparing WWII and politics/government to discussing a movie you have not even seen yet you claim to be just about all(if not all) made up facts.

Why is ok to read about one thing (WW2 or government) and be able to discuss it intelligently and rationally, even though you have no firsthand experience with either, but it's not ok to take another (Michael Moore's movie) and do the same?

In any case, I'd invite you to share with the rest of us what exactly the point of Moore's "documentary" is - what is he trying to prove?

Originally posted by JimmyTango
We are not talking about a little thing that the President didn't really need to sign off on. We are talking about a mass murderer and how 24 of his family members are allowed out of this country without one question on if they may know where he is. This is the kind of decision that only one man should have the power to decide on: The President.

How is a decision that big allowed to be decided on by anyone but the President?

I hate to ruin your preconceived notions about how the government works, Jimmy, but the President is not in on all decisions, even big ones. And besides, isn't it possible that Clarke, in this decision, may have done something he ought not to have done? Why did he authorize the flight, anyway?

by **sgt.worm** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 6:08 pm

vary well said tango you hit the nail on the head

by **Jeffro** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 6:47 pm

Originally posted by Kingofbeers
That strikes me as odd that you hate Michael Moore, Jeffro. Since you are going to be going to a Liberal college and study Music Composition. I think a would be artist such as yourself would at least acknowledge the fact that Moore has attempted to swing the balance of power into the hands of someone he believes that would be better for our country.

I'd say at least go see the movie if you are going to really talk about the message of the film. For all we know everyone who rips on it gets all their information from Repbulican-News Daily and hasn't yet seen the movie.

I hope you aren't in for a extreme rude awakening when you get to Webster, but it seems like you will be.

As an artist, MM is a genious. I disagree with his political views, and the way he stacks up facts.

To be honest, I'm really afraid to switch presidents during the war b/c that could deem disaterous.

I could be sorely mistaken, and it may not be a big deal at all.

But until I get most of the facts down, I'm not voting for Kerry.

<----------Politically confused

by **Ralph Wiggum** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 7:05 pm

I haven't read the rest of the posts yet, but I've been holding Hitchens's article in my back pocket for someone to bring up the film. Good cite Jeffro.

by **Pierce** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 7:18 pm

Good point Jeffro. I actually think the terrorists want Bush out of office and Kerry in - because they know that Bush will do whatever is possible to kick their ass, and that Kerry (being antiwar) will back off and let them kill more innocent people. I also strongly disagree with Moore. I'd surely be a rough time if he became president.

by **King** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 7:23 pm

Originally posted by Pierce
I actually think the terrorists want Bush out of office and Kerry in

Thats a pretty bold statement.

by **Jim0322** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 7:28 pm

Originally posted by Pierce
I actually think the terrorists want Bush out of office and Kerry in - because they know that Bush will do whatever is possible to kick their ass, and that Kerry (being antiwar) will back off and let them kill more innocent people.

The terrorists in the Middle East hate all Americans, even those who are devote followers of Islam. They even hate their own countrymen who don't agree with their "holy war".

Jim

by **Pierce** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 7:30 pm

That is true Jim, but I believe they'd rather have someone who isn't as devoted to killing them as Bush is in office.

by **King** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 8:02 pm

*Edit, posted on the wrong thread.... :mad:

by **Colonel Ingus** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 8:17 pm

Good point Jeffro. I actually think the terrorists want Bush out of office and Kerry in - because they know that Bush will do whatever is possible to kick their ass, and that Kerry (being antiwar) will back off and let them kill more innocent people. I also strongly disagree with Moore. I'd surely be a rough time if he became president.

Exactly how I feel. Now nobody takes this as some kind of "Terrorists and Democrats support each other" crap. Democrats are traditionally weak on defense and prosecuting wars. They like to neogotiate and "RIF" our military (Reduction In Force).

I really hate most of Bush's Domestic policy and things like Medicare, TSA, and the Patriot Act (Patriots fought for freedoms not to take them away) piss me off. However I just can't see Kerry doing an effective job in blunting terrorism.

Most of peoples arguments against being in Iraq and Afghanistan are politically motivated (not all, most. there are people who believe war is wrong no matter what (fools)) and I am sure that there would be a lot of people defending our being, there if the Pres was a Democrat, who currently oppose it. I would be for it no matter who is in office.

Say what you want about American service men dying overseas at least the people they swore to protect aren't dying over here. All those insurgents are who are being killed daily are cannon fodder the terrorists won't be able to deploy here.

So basically I see the choice in our next elecction either (hopefully) good domestic policy and crappy foreign affairs, or crappy domestic policies and nobody killing Americans in America. I am afraid I'll have to vote for the second.

by **Pierce** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 8:53 pm

Thanks Ingus, you summed it up in more detail for me

Now, I don't want any Americans to die - but if a gun was to my head and I had to make a choice, better on someone else's land than the homeland. It's really hard to see one American die - but I'd rather have that than more attacks of the magnitude of 9/11 where many more were killed.

by **Face** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 9:10 pm

Originally posted by Pierce
That is true Jim, but I believe they'd rather have someone who isn't as devoted to killing them as Bush is in office.

Exactly. They would prefer another Clinton in the Whitehouse ... one who looks the other way when they attack US ships, the WTC, Kenyan embassies, etc.

I like Folic_Acid in this debate. He is, after all, in the business.

The administration should back off Howard Stern - if in fact it is true that they are putting a lot of pressure on the radio stations to silence him. This is a major flaw in the adminstration's policy. I agree 100% that "If you dont like it, don't listen!"

Michael Moore want the money, he could care less about what really goes on in this country. You think he really cares about YOU? Ask him to use some of his $$$millions to pay off your mortgage. See how much he cares.

Kerry better never get re-elected. He will tax us up the wazzoo and raise interest rates, thus dropping the market price of the house I just bought in the Bush economy - because of the job I just got in the Bush economy. Also, he will fire up terrorists everywhere because they know he is a puss and will cease all fighting against them and allow them to rebuild.

Bush may not be the smooth talker or the sharp-wit speaker, but he has balls, and he does what he says and says what he is going to do - just ask the Taliban and Saddam Hussein if Bush keeps his word. His honesty is refreshing in a President.

by **King** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 9:22 pm

Originally posted by Face

Michael Moore want the money, he could care less about what really goes on in this country. You think he really cares about YOU? Ask him to use some of his $$$millions to pay off your mortgage. See how much he cares.

Kerry better never get re-elected. He will tax us up the wazzoo and raise interest rates, thus dropping the market price of the house I just bought in the Bush economy - because of the job I just got in the Bush economy. Also, he will fire up terrorists everywhere because they know he is a puss and will cease all fighting against them and allow them to rebuild.

In two short paragraphs you become completely hypocritical. Do you really care about me? you care about me as much as Michael Moore does. Can i borrow a few bucks from you? Or are you too worried about being taxed and paying for your Bush economy house.

The only reason interest rates fell was because after 9-11 everyone was afraid of trading... no one was buying anything. You can still get 0.0% interest loans on cars... the best its ever been. You can't attribute that to Bush. Attribute that to the guys who brought down the two towers.

At least just have the balls to say you don't give a fuck about anyone and that you are interested in being self-serving.

by **Face** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 9:25 pm

Originally posted by Kingofbeers
In two short paragraphs you become completely hypocritical. Do you really care about me? you care about me as much as Michael Moore does. Can i borrow a few bucks from you? Or are you too worried about being taxed and paying for your Bush economy house.

The only reason interest rates fell was because after 9-11 everyone was afraid of trading... no one was buying anything. You can still get 0.0% interest loans on cars... the best its ever been. You can't attribute that to Bush. Attribute that to the guys who brought down the two towers.

At least just have the balls to say you don't give a fuck about anyone and that you are interested in being self-serving.

Did I miss something here? When did I ever claim to care about anyone? Not only that, there is so much flawed in your statement I don't know where to begin!

by **King** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 9:28 pm

Originally posted by Face
Did I miss something here? When did I ever claim to care about anyone? Not only that, there is so much flawed in your statement I don't know where to begin!

At least you care about yourself

Unfairenheit 9/11

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