How many WMD's need be discovered
by Savant » Sat Jul 03, 2004 9:22 pm
Ingus, Id say the support of the 1rst gulf war from arab nations was because they were scared to shit Saddam was going to steamroll over them as well, and all those wonderful Saudis, Kuwaitis to this day would stick a knife in your back if they though that it would get them another buck a barrel for thier product, but they tolerate our presence cause we equip there armys, and keep the buisness of oil going.
Saddam completely deserved his end, and anyone that doesnt believe that Saddam if given the opportunity/weoponry would have set fire to half the planet starting with us..is blind
The bigger threat that really isnt on the front burner is N.Korea why? would they not sell any weopon to any group for the right price? have they not threatened us, lied to us, extorted us? thumbed their nose at the UN, and thrown out nuke inspectors? again i ask why
Saddam completely deserved his end, and anyone that doesnt believe that Saddam if given the opportunity/weoponry would have set fire to half the planet starting with us..is blind
The bigger threat that really isnt on the front burner is N.Korea why? would they not sell any weopon to any group for the right price? have they not threatened us, lied to us, extorted us? thumbed their nose at the UN, and thrown out nuke inspectors? again i ask why
Sal_Monella
- Keekanoo
by Keekanoo » Sun Jul 04, 2004 12:56 am
Ingus... what's with the poor taste in slagging my name? Do you think this will somehow lend you credibility? I'm afraid it does nothing more, in my eyes, than reveal you to have a petty, bullyish nature.
And I'm some kind of red commie tree-hugging anti-American pro saddistic 'evil' freaks because I point out the actual facts behind the first attack upon Iraq by the U.S.?
Lets put it a different way. Canada and the States are involved in a 10 year pitched battle which costs both sides enormous amounts of resources. Towards the end of that, when we're both nearly crippled, Mexico crashes your borders and starts sucking out some precious resource from within the States' turf. You repeatedly go to the World Courts and the UN to have something done about it and nothing is. What would you do? What do you think America would do?
Now, by your own logic, if you attack Mexico, you're in some way going to be compared to Evil-incarnate selfish fiends from The Past.
Bleh. You know what? You can keep your fanatic rhetoric.
And I'm some kind of red commie tree-hugging anti-American pro saddistic 'evil' freaks because I point out the actual facts behind the first attack upon Iraq by the U.S.?
Lets put it a different way. Canada and the States are involved in a 10 year pitched battle which costs both sides enormous amounts of resources. Towards the end of that, when we're both nearly crippled, Mexico crashes your borders and starts sucking out some precious resource from within the States' turf. You repeatedly go to the World Courts and the UN to have something done about it and nothing is. What would you do? What do you think America would do?
Now, by your own logic, if you attack Mexico, you're in some way going to be compared to Evil-incarnate selfish fiends from The Past.
Bleh. You know what? You can keep your fanatic rhetoric.
- beowulf
by beowulf » Sun Jul 04, 2004 2:02 am
Honestly, Keek, I have never heard a thing about "slant drilling". But Ingus does have a point. Whether Saddam had a reason to attack, it is still rather extreme to support him.
I would go as so far to say those facts are not facts. Why wouldn't Iraq have pumps and equipment there along with soldiers? I seriously doubt that you can drill underground for more than 50+ miles! Again, point me to a source and I will have to accept it as fact.
All the US was doing was helping a friendly nation and our interests. Saddam had no right to rape, pillage, torture, and kill innocent humans! Regardless of a so-called right to protect its oil.
The US even made the mistake NOT going to Baghdad to finish Saddam off because that was not the goal. The UN had it set up whrere the coalition was to only drive out Saddam and limit his weaponry. (Thanks UN)
And Savant, we are in talks with N. Korea as we type. Along with China, Japan, and Russia. We already KNOW that they have the technology (thanks to Clinton), so they are not that much of a threat. The real threat comes from countries and extremists that we do not know have 'em. It's called mutual annihalation. N. Korea understands that if they launch a nuke, they will be obliterated! Also, N. Korea is only capable of have only 1 or 2 nukes.
I know that sounds silly as "1 or 2 nukes", but you have to look at it from a military standpoint. The US would outlast them, and they would die.
It's funny how the same people are upset and enraged when the US preemptively strike to make ourselves safer, and then complain when we don't do the same to another! Come on. Both situations are complex, totally different, and under different contexts.
Keek and Sav, you are the 2 admins I most respect, and still do, I just hope this won't make things weird at the Beach!
beo
I would go as so far to say those facts are not facts. Why wouldn't Iraq have pumps and equipment there along with soldiers? I seriously doubt that you can drill underground for more than 50+ miles! Again, point me to a source and I will have to accept it as fact.
All the US was doing was helping a friendly nation and our interests. Saddam had no right to rape, pillage, torture, and kill innocent humans! Regardless of a so-called right to protect its oil.
The US even made the mistake NOT going to Baghdad to finish Saddam off because that was not the goal. The UN had it set up whrere the coalition was to only drive out Saddam and limit his weaponry. (Thanks UN)
And Savant, we are in talks with N. Korea as we type. Along with China, Japan, and Russia. We already KNOW that they have the technology (thanks to Clinton), so they are not that much of a threat. The real threat comes from countries and extremists that we do not know have 'em. It's called mutual annihalation. N. Korea understands that if they launch a nuke, they will be obliterated! Also, N. Korea is only capable of have only 1 or 2 nukes.
I know that sounds silly as "1 or 2 nukes", but you have to look at it from a military standpoint. The US would outlast them, and they would die.
It's funny how the same people are upset and enraged when the US preemptively strike to make ourselves safer, and then complain when we don't do the same to another! Come on. Both situations are complex, totally different, and under different contexts.
Keek and Sav, you are the 2 admins I most respect, and still do, I just hope this won't make things weird at the Beach!
beo
- LeVar Burton
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by LeVar Burton » Sun Jul 04, 2004 2:15 am
Keek, what we find so rediculous is that you seem to support an Iraqi invasion of Kuwait because of this slant drilling, but when so many anti-Iraq war activists were saying, "war should be the last option, we should try peaceable solutions first," it seems contradictory to justify an invasion of Kuwait when there are more peaceable means to stop this "slant drilling."
You seem so willing to accept the reason of slant drilling, yet so reluctanct to accept the WMD reason. And before you say we haven't found any, I'd like to point out that it took us months to find Saddam, who is a living person that has to eat, drink, and presumably converse with other people. How long will it take to find inanimate objects?
I try to keep an open mind, but it really does seem like everyone outside of the U.S. shares the opposition's view by default.
You seem so willing to accept the reason of slant drilling, yet so reluctanct to accept the WMD reason. And before you say we haven't found any, I'd like to point out that it took us months to find Saddam, who is a living person that has to eat, drink, and presumably converse with other people. How long will it take to find inanimate objects?
I try to keep an open mind, but it really does seem like everyone outside of the U.S. shares the opposition's view by default.
- beowulf
by beowulf » Sun Jul 04, 2004 2:21 am
Originally posted by Colonel Ingus
And correct me if I am wrong but didn't we go to the U.N. then, get a resolution, and enforced it? Almost exactly like what we did 12 years later.
And yes.....anybody with common sense assumed Iraq had WMD's. I would go so far to say we didn't need the UN resolution that Bush got passed.
Get this, when Iraq surrendered in '91, they agreed to No Fly Zones, full disclosure of weaponry, and ending the aggression.
Throughout the 90's, (Clinton years) Saddam still did pretty much what he wanted. And with the help of the UN's "Oil for food" program, reamained wealthy. (Scandal now pertaining that and Koffi Annan's son!) Saddam still shot at our planes patrolling the NFZ's, NEVER fully disclosed WMD's, etc. So I think the US had the right to resume wartime activities with Iraq since they NEVER abided(sp?) by their surrneder!
IMO, this situation should've been handled by Clinton instead of passed onto Bush! Such as the terrorist attacks on the WTC in '93, the Khobar Towers in Saudia Arabia, the timed bombings of US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania, the USS Cole, etc.
Also Ingus, GREAT point on Kerry in OCT of 03! Who DIDN"T think that? And why are other people from other nations sooo concerned about what the US does? Oh yeah, WE LEAD, WE FEED, and WE ARE COMPASSIONATE! Think of the world sans US! ( a little French lingo there) Total chaos IMO. Would Canada step up to the plate? C'mon.
beo
- Keekanoo
by Keekanoo » Sun Jul 04, 2004 8:35 am
This will be a long post, but provides an accurate synopsis of events leading up to, including, and post Iraq invasion of Kuwait.
The following excerpt comes from here--a very good resource tool containing very helpful buried links.
http://www.ringnebula.com/Oil/Timeline-Iraq_040903c.htm
1954 - 1956 1954: The US granted Iraq military and economic aid.
1955: Iraq joined the US drawn "Baghdad Pact" (15) of Turkey, Pakistan, Iran, and later Britain. This was feared by Israel as the alliance excluded them. Egypt's President Nasser rejected the Baghdad Pact and accepted Soviet arms, raising his regional status in his rejection of Western influence. (See: US Secretary of State reaction. (16) )
Egypt - 1956: Nasser nationalized the Suez Canal. (17). After an Israeli ship was seized in the Canal, with two Israelis being executed in Egypt, Israel attacked the Gaza Strip - then under Egypt's control. Syria and Jordan offered Egypt military aid if requested, and Nasser threatened that Israel was doomed. Israel responded on October 29 by invading the Sinai peninsula [The Sinai-Suez War], with Britain and France joining Israel's efforts against Egypt. Within one week, Israel controlled the Gaza Strip and the Sinai. The Soviets responded by threatening to intervene on Egypt's behalf prompting a stand-down, and Israel's return of the captured territory.
1958 - 1959 Years of public impoverishment, while oil wealth flowed to Iraq's leaders and to Western oil companies, lead to a sudden revolution, lead by Brigadier Abdul-Karim Qassem, overthrowing the British installed king (18). Qassem supported poor farmers and middle class workers, allowed trade unions to form, worked to end the feudal land system long in place, and lifted a ban on Iraq's Communist Party. Qassem also attempted to negotiate with the Iraq Petroleum Company to increase Iraq's royalties (finally passing Public Law 80 (19) in 1961- see below). The US and Britain responded with rapid troop deployment to Jordan and Lebanon to head off further regional (and anti-
Oct. 7, 1959 22 yo Ba'ath party member, Saddam Hussein failed to assassinate Qassem in a CIA backed coup attempt (20). Hussein suffered a bullet wound to his own leg, and fled to Syria, then Egypt.(He escaped an imprisonment upon his later return, eventually helping to lead a successful Ba'athist coup in 1968.)
1961 Qassem repeatedly called for reunification of Iraq w/ Kuwait (21) stating at a June 19, 1961 press conference: "Iraq regards Kuwait as an integral part of its territory." Britain immediately stationed troops in Kuwait and positioned naval forces in the Gulf.
Public Law 80 (22) was passed in December, prohibiting concessions being granted to foreign companies. Qassem also transferred control over Iraq's oil resources to an Iraq National Oil Company. This, plus the fact that a few cabinet positions were filled with people sympathetic to Communist Party goals, lead the US to label the events as a communist takeover, and to begin actively supporting the Ba'ath Party. Furthermore, the Soviets began making overtures toward the new Iraqi government.
Feb. 8, 1963 Qassem was overthrown and subsequently assassinated via a second CIA backed coup (23a), with Ba'ath Party taking power under A.S. Arif. Thousands of Communist Party members were executed (with the list of members evidently provided by the US(23b). Arif held the presidency through his death in 1966 when the presidency was assumed by his brother, General Abdul Rahman Arif.
1964 The USSR continued to offer support to regional revolutionary movements.
June 1967 "Six Day War" (24) fought with Israeli capture of the West Bank, Gaza, East Jerusalem, Egypt's Sinai Peninsula, and Syria's Golan Heights. With the war lost, Nasser resigned. (See: Nasser's resignation speech June 7, 1967. (25)) Iraq-US diplomatic relations were immediately severed .
1968 Arif was toppled by another factional Ba'athist coup July 17, 1968, with Tikriti born, General Ahmed Hasan al-Bakr (26) named as president and Saddam Hussein (27) (who had helped lead the Ba'athists in the failed 1959 coup (20) ) was named as Vice President. Within two weeks many potential rivals were either purged or in some way weakened. (From this position, Hussein developed a vast network of secret police (28) who continued to execute dissident left voices.)
1971 Iraq broke off diplomatic connections with Iran after Iran occupied Persian Gulf Iraqi islands. (29). (Finally settled in 1975 with Iran retaining the islands.)
June 1, 1972 Bakr and Hussein (30a) were supported by the US until this year, when the Iraqi-Soviet Friendship Treaty (30b) was announced in April followed by the Iraqi oil-fields being nationalized (30c) in June, creating the Iraq Petroleum Company. (Note: this occurred after the price of oil, set by OPEC (the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries), was raised from $3 per barrel to $22.) The US State Department under Nixon shifted support to the Shah of Iran, providing an eventual $22 billion in arms sales (31), while labeling Hussein as "unreliable," placed Iraq on the list of terrorist supporting nations, and began arming Iraqi Kurds in the north. [see: video quote of former Secretary of State Ramsey Clark in Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
1974 Peace agreement with the Kurdish Democratic Party collapsed with suppression of Kurdish uprising and resulting refugee crisis. Despite the US's role in encouraging and supporting the Kurdish revolt, it refused to aid the refugees. Kissinger, who had been responsible for crafting the plan stated: "Covert action should not be confused with missionary work (33)."
1975 Iraq and Iran signed the Algiers Accord (34) regarding control of the Shatt-al-Arab waterway that defined an important border between the two countries that allowed Iraq a water passage to the Gulf. With the accord signed, the US-[Nixon]-controlled Shah of Iran immediately withdrew support of the Kurds and stepped up the arming of Iran. (Primary US interest at the time was in limiting USSR influence in the region given the vast petroleum reserves at stake.)
1976 Amnesty International described Iran (35) as having the "highest rate of death penalties in the world, no valid system of civilian courts and a history of torture which is beyond belief. No country in the world has a worse record in human rights than Iran."
1977 The Ayatollah Khomeini was expelled from Iraq, where he had lived in exile since the 1960s. He thereafter moved to France until the upcoming Iranian revolution a short time later (36).
SUMMARY OF EVENTS RE: KHOMEINI: The Shah of Iran passed a series of new laws during the early '60s, understood by the population to have been created under US influence/dominance, and calculated to bring personal benefit to the Shah. This was vigorously protested by the Ayatollah Khomeini, other religious leaders, and the public. The Shah responded with brutal attacks on demonstrators, killing many thousands of them, and in Khomeini's imprisonment. Protests were suppressed, but not ended. Ongoing demands for Khomeini's freedom led to his release and exile in Turkey and then Iraq in 1964, where he lived for the next several years. In 1977, rebellion exploded throughout Iran after the Shah's security police assassinated Khomeini's eldest son, who had also been exiled to Iraq. The Shah, hoping distance would interfere with Khomeini's aid to the growing Iranian rebellion, requested he be expelled from Iraq. That request was granted in 1978, Khomeini's then moving to a hamlet in France where he lived until his return to revolutionary Iran one year later (1979).
1979 Iran: The Shah's obvious Western acquiescence along with his continued use of oppressive secret police tactics finally resulted in widespread popular rebellion, then in a full scale revolution in January. The Shah was ousted in February and fled the country. Khomeini, who had earlier returned from France, took control, vowed to spread the Islamic Revolution, and called for nationalism, anti-Americanism, and Islamic fundamentalism (37a). The American embassy in Teheran was overrun a few months later - Nov. 4, with several American diplomats being taken hostage. (The captors demanded that the Shah be returned from the US, where he had been granted asylum. (37b) (Note: The Shah of Iran was said to have died of cancer in Panama the following year - July 27, 1980.)
Iraq: The US, alarmed over the loss of regional influence (and a corresponding increase in Soviet influence), shifted support back to Hussein in Iraq. Saddam Hussein replaced General Bakr, becoming the Iraqi President and Chairman of the Revolutionary Command Council. Hundreds of party members were immediately executed. Shortly after, Hussein nullified the Algiers [Shatt-al-Arab waterway] Agreement, claiming full control over the waterway (38).
1980 The "Carter Doctrine" (39a), was announced, stating: "... an attempt by any outside force to gain control of the Persian Gulf region will be regarded as an assault on the vital interests of the United States of America. And such an assault will be repelled by any means necessary, including military force." (39b)
IRAQ-IRAN WAR: Iraq was supplied military materials by the US, despite the arms embargo in effect, and by September, following a series of border clashes, Iraq invaded its neighbor. [See: Iran-Iraq War (38), and Issues prompting war (40)] Note: Two months into the war (Nov.1980), Khomeini expressed interest in releasing the hostages provided: Iranian assets were released, all sanctions were canceled, and that all of the Shah’s property was returned to Iran. Two months later the agreement was completed and a few weeks later - all remaining hostages were released on January 20, 1981 (immediately upon Reagan’s inauguration).
1980s (early) Hussein known to be developing and acquiring chemical and biologic weapons (See:"IRAQ - US Military Items Exported or Transferred to Iraq in the 1980s." (41)
1980 (early) Evidence exists that a deal was stuck with Iranian intermediaries ("October Surprise (39c)") in which Iran would release the fifty-two hostages held, delivering them over to a newly inaugurated Reagan/Bush administration in 1981 (as it was highly likely Carter would be unseated). In return, arms would be shipped covertly (via Israel) during the last weeks of the presidential campaign. (A very similar scheme was again utilized in 1985, in another covert arms-for-hostages deal - see "Iran-Contra (47a)" below.) [see: October Surprise - America's Hostages in Iran and the Election of Ronald Reagan, by Gary Sick; RandomHouse, 1991] [See Also 39d, 39e, 39f, 39g, 39h]
1981 Israel attacked and destroyed Iraq's Osirak nuclear reactor (42).
1982 Under Reagan's new administration (inaug.: 1981), Iraq was removed from the US's list of terrorist-supporting countries. (43)
1983 - 1985 Truck bombs were detonated in Lebanon against American targets in April and October 1983. Pro-Iranian terrorists were said to have been involved in the attacks (44a)/(44b)/(44e). (Multiple seizures of American hostages earlier in Iran, and again, repeatedly in Lebanon in 1983 and 1984 eventually lead to the "Iran-Contra" plan in 1985. (see below (47a)).
1983 - 1984 Reagan's special envoy - Donald Rumsfeld repeatedly met with Hussein (45a) regarding the US-Iraq relationship and mutual interests. Rumsfeld did not raise the issue of Iraq's use of chemical weapons despite the fact that the State Department was well aware of Hussein's use of those weapons in 1982 and 1983 (45b).
1984 Full diplomatic relations between Iraq and the US were reestablished (46a) and increased support in the form of weapons, intelligence information, etc. were given to Hussein (46b).
1985 Reagan administration IRAN-CONTRA (47a) plan: Oliver North worked with Iran, promising US aid to help them topple Saddam Hussein. A deal was struck whereby the Reagan administration, in cooperation with the Israeli government, would secure the release of the American hostages held in Lebanon via the sale of various arms materials, including one-thousand TOW missiles to Iran. (This occurred secretly via official sale of the weapons to Israel. Israel then secretly passed them along to Iran.) A portion of the proceeds of those illegal sales were to be delivered to the Nicaraguan Contras to finance their insurgency against the Sandinista socialist regime then in power, despite Congress' clear expression that such actions were forbidden. (See also: (47b), White House Email (47c), CIA's description of cocaine connection (47d), Senate Committee Report (47e), and video testimony of US Dept. of State, David Welch in Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
1986 Iraq's use of mustard gas and nerve agents against Iranian soldiers well known to Reagan, VP Bush, Sr., and by senior national security aids (48a). Despite this, US aid to Iraq was increased (including chemical and biologic agents (48b) and (48c)).
(1986 - early 1990s) Regarding Afghanistan, the Taliban, Osama bin Laden, and the creation of al Qaeda, see: "Timeline-1 Afghanistan."
1984-87 Persian Gulf Iran-Iraq "Tanker War (49)."
1987 General Norman Schwartzkopf, Jr. named to head CENT-COM. (Note: General Norman Schwartzkopf, Sr. had helped the Shah of Iran develop the brutal SAVAK secret police thirty years earlier.) Following Iranian military successes in the Iran-Iraq war, the decision was made to send send a massive US naval force into the Gulf (50).
1988 Hussein attacked Iranian troops and Kurdish opponents in northern Iraq (Halabja) (51) in the Anfal campaign, again using chemical agents - killing 5,000. Total deaths in the campaign have been estimated at 100,000. Despite these known events, the US continued to send billions to Hussein for "agricultural purposes." (Items included armored trucks, helicopters, large amounts of pesticide chemicals, and anthrax.) Concerns regarding the funding of these items were raised in Congress and were quelled by the Reagan/Bush, Sr. White house.[Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
Aug. 20, 1988 Ceasefire with Iran. By end of war with Iran, Iraq was economically devastated (52). In order for Hussein to maintain his power-base, he announced a $40 billion program of rebuilding, requiring a maximization of oil income. [Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
1989 As other Gulf states, including Kuwait, had recently increased oil production, thereby driving down oil prices, Hussein's plans to rebuild Iraq were frustrated - financing his large army became problematic. He thus began to publicly threaten Kuwait because of their 1) 20% increase in oil shipments over agreed upon quotas, and 2) for slant-drilling/extraction of oil from fields over the Iraqi side of the border. [Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)] In response to these statements, the US revised an earlier plan written to counter Soviet threat to the region - War Plan 1002 - renaming Iraq as main threat in region, and renaming the plan as 1002-90 (53).
Jan. 1990 CENT-COM conducted computer analysis/games - testing Plan 1002-90. [Video testimony - Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)] US War College report written: "Baghdad should not be expected to deliberately provoke military confrontations with anyone (54). Its best interests now and in immediate future are served by peace."
Feb. 1990 General Norman Schwartzkopf, Jr. argued to Congress for increased US presence in the Gulf.
May 1990 Saddam Hussein publicly accused Gulf states of waging economic war against Iraq, with Kuwait singled out as using American equipment to achieve slant-drilling across the border into Iraq's oil-fields (55). At this same time and following urging from the US, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia demanded immediate repayment of loans earlier made to Iraq. In response, Hussein began moving large numbers of troops to the Kuwaiti border. [Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
July 27, 1990 Despite these growing tensions between Iraq and Kuwait, and despite the US's dependence on cheap Kuwaiti oil, the US State Department issued the statement that it was aware of the movement of Iraqi troops threatening Kuwait, but that "there are no special defense or security commitments to Kuwait." -- Telegraphing a straight forward message to Hussein: an invasion of Kuwait would not be countered. [See: 1. Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32) video footage of 07-27-90 US State Dept. Briefing, 2. N.Y.Times excerpts re: Meeting with US Envoy (56a), 3. Reported that US Ambassador April Glaspie issued the same information to Hussein July 25, 1990 (56b)/(56c), 4. Summary study of this disinformation program (56d).] These reports of Ms. Glaspie's meeting with Saddam Hussein were officially countered by the US government, although the State Department declined to release meeting transcripts (56e)..
Aug. 2, 1990 Iraq invaded Kuwait. UN Security Council Resolution 660 (57a) immediately passed - condemning Iraq for invasion of Kuwait. All Iraqi assets in the US were immediately frozen (57b) and the US Navy instituted a blockade of the Iraqi coast before the UN had a chance to convene.
Aug. 1990 Bush Sr. expressed shock at Iraqi invasion, despite the fact that for several months it had practiced for the exact military situation with troops and armaments in place in the middle east poised for response. [General Norman Schwarzkopf, Jr.: "We went ahead and did an exercise, what's called a command post exercise, which is what 'Internal Look' was, to test our ability to deal with this particular scenario and also to uncover any command and control problems that might exist, any doctrine problems that might exist between the air force, and the navy and the army forces. And it just so happened that we were in the middle of conducting the "Internal Look Command Post" exercises at the same time that the crisis developed in the Gulf." [Video testimony within the highly regarded film "Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)"]
Aug. 5, 1990 US State Dept. representatives, including General Colin Powell, flew to Saudi Arabia, telling them that the Iraqis were amassing on their borders preparing to invade. Official press releases included the fact that the Saudis were shown satellite photographs proving this buildup. [ABC and the St. Petersburg times revealed January 6, 1991 that commercial satellite photographs obtained from that same period did not show the claimed buildup (58a) - i.e.. the military photos shown to the Saudis were falsified (58b). [See discussion of evidence (58c) , CS Monitor coverage(58d), and video testimony within Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
Aug. 6, 1990 UN Security Council Resolution 661 (59) passed - levying sanctions against Iraq and setting a deadline set of 1/15/91 - i.e.. Martin Luther King, Jr. birthday, for Iraq's withdrawal from Kuwait.
Aug. 7-8, 1990 Saudi Arabia's King Fahd, after being told by US representatives that Iraq was preparing to invade (see Aug. 5, 1990 above) agreed to the basing of US forces on Saudi land (fulfilling a long held US ambition). Over the next 24 hours, without pre-notification of Congress, forty-thousand troops and a cache of military supplies were flown to Saudi Arabia. [See: 60a, 60b, 60c, 60d, and Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
Aug. 8, 1990 Iraq announced the annexation of Kuwait (61).
Aug. 25, 1990 UN Security Council Resolution 665 (62) passed - calling for use of force if Iraq failed to withdraw from Kuwait.
Nov. 8, 1990 US increased forces within the area to 400,000 (mostly in Saudi Arabia). The stationing of US troops on sacred Saudi soil infuriated Osama bin Laden, a wealthy Saudi. [Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
Nov. 29, 1990 UN Security Council Resolution 678 (63) passed by a vote of 12-2 w/ China abstaining - authorizing the use of force if Iraq failed to withdraw from Kuwait by Jan. 15, 1991. [UN states were pressured by the US to vote for war. Example: Yemen voted against the use of force resolution, following which a US representative was quoted as stating "that will be the most expensive no vote you ever cast." 3 days later, Yemen - the poorest country in the Arab world - had its entire aid budget cut by the US. (64)]
Jan. 12, 1991 US Congress authorized use of force if Iraq hasn't withdrawn from Kuwait, pursuant to UNSC 678, by Jan. 15, 1991 [Joint Res.77 (65), becoming Public Law No: 102-1 on 1/14/91]
Jan. 17, 1991 US lead "Operation Desert Storm" began air assault using "pinpoint accuracy" (only 8% of bombs used were of the -smart- variety, despite mainstream press reports (66)). The bombing resulted in the deaths of 150,000 to 200,000 people, including thousands of innocent civilians. Bombing included reservoirs, filtration and water treatment plants (67a), electric power distribution, food distribution systems. Civilian deaths included 1,500 within the Al-Amariyah shelter. Kuwait entered by coalition forces. (See: Jan. 15, 1991 National Security Directive #54 (67b))
The following excerpt comes from here--a very good resource tool containing very helpful buried links.
http://www.ringnebula.com/Oil/Timeline-Iraq_040903c.htm
1954 - 1956 1954: The US granted Iraq military and economic aid.
1955: Iraq joined the US drawn "Baghdad Pact" (15) of Turkey, Pakistan, Iran, and later Britain. This was feared by Israel as the alliance excluded them. Egypt's President Nasser rejected the Baghdad Pact and accepted Soviet arms, raising his regional status in his rejection of Western influence. (See: US Secretary of State reaction. (16) )
Egypt - 1956: Nasser nationalized the Suez Canal. (17). After an Israeli ship was seized in the Canal, with two Israelis being executed in Egypt, Israel attacked the Gaza Strip - then under Egypt's control. Syria and Jordan offered Egypt military aid if requested, and Nasser threatened that Israel was doomed. Israel responded on October 29 by invading the Sinai peninsula [The Sinai-Suez War], with Britain and France joining Israel's efforts against Egypt. Within one week, Israel controlled the Gaza Strip and the Sinai. The Soviets responded by threatening to intervene on Egypt's behalf prompting a stand-down, and Israel's return of the captured territory.
1958 - 1959 Years of public impoverishment, while oil wealth flowed to Iraq's leaders and to Western oil companies, lead to a sudden revolution, lead by Brigadier Abdul-Karim Qassem, overthrowing the British installed king (18). Qassem supported poor farmers and middle class workers, allowed trade unions to form, worked to end the feudal land system long in place, and lifted a ban on Iraq's Communist Party. Qassem also attempted to negotiate with the Iraq Petroleum Company to increase Iraq's royalties (finally passing Public Law 80 (19) in 1961- see below). The US and Britain responded with rapid troop deployment to Jordan and Lebanon to head off further regional (and anti-
Oct. 7, 1959 22 yo Ba'ath party member, Saddam Hussein failed to assassinate Qassem in a CIA backed coup attempt (20). Hussein suffered a bullet wound to his own leg, and fled to Syria, then Egypt.(He escaped an imprisonment upon his later return, eventually helping to lead a successful Ba'athist coup in 1968.)
1961 Qassem repeatedly called for reunification of Iraq w/ Kuwait (21) stating at a June 19, 1961 press conference: "Iraq regards Kuwait as an integral part of its territory." Britain immediately stationed troops in Kuwait and positioned naval forces in the Gulf.
Public Law 80 (22) was passed in December, prohibiting concessions being granted to foreign companies. Qassem also transferred control over Iraq's oil resources to an Iraq National Oil Company. This, plus the fact that a few cabinet positions were filled with people sympathetic to Communist Party goals, lead the US to label the events as a communist takeover, and to begin actively supporting the Ba'ath Party. Furthermore, the Soviets began making overtures toward the new Iraqi government.
Feb. 8, 1963 Qassem was overthrown and subsequently assassinated via a second CIA backed coup (23a), with Ba'ath Party taking power under A.S. Arif. Thousands of Communist Party members were executed (with the list of members evidently provided by the US(23b). Arif held the presidency through his death in 1966 when the presidency was assumed by his brother, General Abdul Rahman Arif.
1964 The USSR continued to offer support to regional revolutionary movements.
June 1967 "Six Day War" (24) fought with Israeli capture of the West Bank, Gaza, East Jerusalem, Egypt's Sinai Peninsula, and Syria's Golan Heights. With the war lost, Nasser resigned. (See: Nasser's resignation speech June 7, 1967. (25)) Iraq-US diplomatic relations were immediately severed .
1968 Arif was toppled by another factional Ba'athist coup July 17, 1968, with Tikriti born, General Ahmed Hasan al-Bakr (26) named as president and Saddam Hussein (27) (who had helped lead the Ba'athists in the failed 1959 coup (20) ) was named as Vice President. Within two weeks many potential rivals were either purged or in some way weakened. (From this position, Hussein developed a vast network of secret police (28) who continued to execute dissident left voices.)
1971 Iraq broke off diplomatic connections with Iran after Iran occupied Persian Gulf Iraqi islands. (29). (Finally settled in 1975 with Iran retaining the islands.)
June 1, 1972 Bakr and Hussein (30a) were supported by the US until this year, when the Iraqi-Soviet Friendship Treaty (30b) was announced in April followed by the Iraqi oil-fields being nationalized (30c) in June, creating the Iraq Petroleum Company. (Note: this occurred after the price of oil, set by OPEC (the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries), was raised from $3 per barrel to $22.) The US State Department under Nixon shifted support to the Shah of Iran, providing an eventual $22 billion in arms sales (31), while labeling Hussein as "unreliable," placed Iraq on the list of terrorist supporting nations, and began arming Iraqi Kurds in the north. [see: video quote of former Secretary of State Ramsey Clark in Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
1974 Peace agreement with the Kurdish Democratic Party collapsed with suppression of Kurdish uprising and resulting refugee crisis. Despite the US's role in encouraging and supporting the Kurdish revolt, it refused to aid the refugees. Kissinger, who had been responsible for crafting the plan stated: "Covert action should not be confused with missionary work (33)."
1975 Iraq and Iran signed the Algiers Accord (34) regarding control of the Shatt-al-Arab waterway that defined an important border between the two countries that allowed Iraq a water passage to the Gulf. With the accord signed, the US-[Nixon]-controlled Shah of Iran immediately withdrew support of the Kurds and stepped up the arming of Iran. (Primary US interest at the time was in limiting USSR influence in the region given the vast petroleum reserves at stake.)
1976 Amnesty International described Iran (35) as having the "highest rate of death penalties in the world, no valid system of civilian courts and a history of torture which is beyond belief. No country in the world has a worse record in human rights than Iran."
1977 The Ayatollah Khomeini was expelled from Iraq, where he had lived in exile since the 1960s. He thereafter moved to France until the upcoming Iranian revolution a short time later (36).
SUMMARY OF EVENTS RE: KHOMEINI: The Shah of Iran passed a series of new laws during the early '60s, understood by the population to have been created under US influence/dominance, and calculated to bring personal benefit to the Shah. This was vigorously protested by the Ayatollah Khomeini, other religious leaders, and the public. The Shah responded with brutal attacks on demonstrators, killing many thousands of them, and in Khomeini's imprisonment. Protests were suppressed, but not ended. Ongoing demands for Khomeini's freedom led to his release and exile in Turkey and then Iraq in 1964, where he lived for the next several years. In 1977, rebellion exploded throughout Iran after the Shah's security police assassinated Khomeini's eldest son, who had also been exiled to Iraq. The Shah, hoping distance would interfere with Khomeini's aid to the growing Iranian rebellion, requested he be expelled from Iraq. That request was granted in 1978, Khomeini's then moving to a hamlet in France where he lived until his return to revolutionary Iran one year later (1979).
1979 Iran: The Shah's obvious Western acquiescence along with his continued use of oppressive secret police tactics finally resulted in widespread popular rebellion, then in a full scale revolution in January. The Shah was ousted in February and fled the country. Khomeini, who had earlier returned from France, took control, vowed to spread the Islamic Revolution, and called for nationalism, anti-Americanism, and Islamic fundamentalism (37a). The American embassy in Teheran was overrun a few months later - Nov. 4, with several American diplomats being taken hostage. (The captors demanded that the Shah be returned from the US, where he had been granted asylum. (37b) (Note: The Shah of Iran was said to have died of cancer in Panama the following year - July 27, 1980.)
Iraq: The US, alarmed over the loss of regional influence (and a corresponding increase in Soviet influence), shifted support back to Hussein in Iraq. Saddam Hussein replaced General Bakr, becoming the Iraqi President and Chairman of the Revolutionary Command Council. Hundreds of party members were immediately executed. Shortly after, Hussein nullified the Algiers [Shatt-al-Arab waterway] Agreement, claiming full control over the waterway (38).
1980 The "Carter Doctrine" (39a), was announced, stating: "... an attempt by any outside force to gain control of the Persian Gulf region will be regarded as an assault on the vital interests of the United States of America. And such an assault will be repelled by any means necessary, including military force." (39b)
IRAQ-IRAN WAR: Iraq was supplied military materials by the US, despite the arms embargo in effect, and by September, following a series of border clashes, Iraq invaded its neighbor. [See: Iran-Iraq War (38), and Issues prompting war (40)] Note: Two months into the war (Nov.1980), Khomeini expressed interest in releasing the hostages provided: Iranian assets were released, all sanctions were canceled, and that all of the Shah’s property was returned to Iran. Two months later the agreement was completed and a few weeks later - all remaining hostages were released on January 20, 1981 (immediately upon Reagan’s inauguration).
1980s (early) Hussein known to be developing and acquiring chemical and biologic weapons (See:"IRAQ - US Military Items Exported or Transferred to Iraq in the 1980s." (41)
1980 (early) Evidence exists that a deal was stuck with Iranian intermediaries ("October Surprise (39c)") in which Iran would release the fifty-two hostages held, delivering them over to a newly inaugurated Reagan/Bush administration in 1981 (as it was highly likely Carter would be unseated). In return, arms would be shipped covertly (via Israel) during the last weeks of the presidential campaign. (A very similar scheme was again utilized in 1985, in another covert arms-for-hostages deal - see "Iran-Contra (47a)" below.) [see: October Surprise - America's Hostages in Iran and the Election of Ronald Reagan, by Gary Sick; RandomHouse, 1991] [See Also 39d, 39e, 39f, 39g, 39h]
1981 Israel attacked and destroyed Iraq's Osirak nuclear reactor (42).
1982 Under Reagan's new administration (inaug.: 1981), Iraq was removed from the US's list of terrorist-supporting countries. (43)
1983 - 1985 Truck bombs were detonated in Lebanon against American targets in April and October 1983. Pro-Iranian terrorists were said to have been involved in the attacks (44a)/(44b)/(44e). (Multiple seizures of American hostages earlier in Iran, and again, repeatedly in Lebanon in 1983 and 1984 eventually lead to the "Iran-Contra" plan in 1985. (see below (47a)).
1983 - 1984 Reagan's special envoy - Donald Rumsfeld repeatedly met with Hussein (45a) regarding the US-Iraq relationship and mutual interests. Rumsfeld did not raise the issue of Iraq's use of chemical weapons despite the fact that the State Department was well aware of Hussein's use of those weapons in 1982 and 1983 (45b).
1984 Full diplomatic relations between Iraq and the US were reestablished (46a) and increased support in the form of weapons, intelligence information, etc. were given to Hussein (46b).
1985 Reagan administration IRAN-CONTRA (47a) plan: Oliver North worked with Iran, promising US aid to help them topple Saddam Hussein. A deal was struck whereby the Reagan administration, in cooperation with the Israeli government, would secure the release of the American hostages held in Lebanon via the sale of various arms materials, including one-thousand TOW missiles to Iran. (This occurred secretly via official sale of the weapons to Israel. Israel then secretly passed them along to Iran.) A portion of the proceeds of those illegal sales were to be delivered to the Nicaraguan Contras to finance their insurgency against the Sandinista socialist regime then in power, despite Congress' clear expression that such actions were forbidden. (See also: (47b), White House Email (47c), CIA's description of cocaine connection (47d), Senate Committee Report (47e), and video testimony of US Dept. of State, David Welch in Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
1986 Iraq's use of mustard gas and nerve agents against Iranian soldiers well known to Reagan, VP Bush, Sr., and by senior national security aids (48a). Despite this, US aid to Iraq was increased (including chemical and biologic agents (48b) and (48c)).
(1986 - early 1990s) Regarding Afghanistan, the Taliban, Osama bin Laden, and the creation of al Qaeda, see: "Timeline-1 Afghanistan."
1984-87 Persian Gulf Iran-Iraq "Tanker War (49)."
1987 General Norman Schwartzkopf, Jr. named to head CENT-COM. (Note: General Norman Schwartzkopf, Sr. had helped the Shah of Iran develop the brutal SAVAK secret police thirty years earlier.) Following Iranian military successes in the Iran-Iraq war, the decision was made to send send a massive US naval force into the Gulf (50).
1988 Hussein attacked Iranian troops and Kurdish opponents in northern Iraq (Halabja) (51) in the Anfal campaign, again using chemical agents - killing 5,000. Total deaths in the campaign have been estimated at 100,000. Despite these known events, the US continued to send billions to Hussein for "agricultural purposes." (Items included armored trucks, helicopters, large amounts of pesticide chemicals, and anthrax.) Concerns regarding the funding of these items were raised in Congress and were quelled by the Reagan/Bush, Sr. White house.[Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
Aug. 20, 1988 Ceasefire with Iran. By end of war with Iran, Iraq was economically devastated (52). In order for Hussein to maintain his power-base, he announced a $40 billion program of rebuilding, requiring a maximization of oil income. [Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
1989 As other Gulf states, including Kuwait, had recently increased oil production, thereby driving down oil prices, Hussein's plans to rebuild Iraq were frustrated - financing his large army became problematic. He thus began to publicly threaten Kuwait because of their 1) 20% increase in oil shipments over agreed upon quotas, and 2) for slant-drilling/extraction of oil from fields over the Iraqi side of the border. [Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)] In response to these statements, the US revised an earlier plan written to counter Soviet threat to the region - War Plan 1002 - renaming Iraq as main threat in region, and renaming the plan as 1002-90 (53).
Jan. 1990 CENT-COM conducted computer analysis/games - testing Plan 1002-90. [Video testimony - Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)] US War College report written: "Baghdad should not be expected to deliberately provoke military confrontations with anyone (54). Its best interests now and in immediate future are served by peace."
Feb. 1990 General Norman Schwartzkopf, Jr. argued to Congress for increased US presence in the Gulf.
May 1990 Saddam Hussein publicly accused Gulf states of waging economic war against Iraq, with Kuwait singled out as using American equipment to achieve slant-drilling across the border into Iraq's oil-fields (55). At this same time and following urging from the US, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia demanded immediate repayment of loans earlier made to Iraq. In response, Hussein began moving large numbers of troops to the Kuwaiti border. [Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
July 27, 1990 Despite these growing tensions between Iraq and Kuwait, and despite the US's dependence on cheap Kuwaiti oil, the US State Department issued the statement that it was aware of the movement of Iraqi troops threatening Kuwait, but that "there are no special defense or security commitments to Kuwait." -- Telegraphing a straight forward message to Hussein: an invasion of Kuwait would not be countered. [See: 1. Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32) video footage of 07-27-90 US State Dept. Briefing, 2. N.Y.Times excerpts re: Meeting with US Envoy (56a), 3. Reported that US Ambassador April Glaspie issued the same information to Hussein July 25, 1990 (56b)/(56c), 4. Summary study of this disinformation program (56d).] These reports of Ms. Glaspie's meeting with Saddam Hussein were officially countered by the US government, although the State Department declined to release meeting transcripts (56e)..
Aug. 2, 1990 Iraq invaded Kuwait. UN Security Council Resolution 660 (57a) immediately passed - condemning Iraq for invasion of Kuwait. All Iraqi assets in the US were immediately frozen (57b) and the US Navy instituted a blockade of the Iraqi coast before the UN had a chance to convene.
Aug. 1990 Bush Sr. expressed shock at Iraqi invasion, despite the fact that for several months it had practiced for the exact military situation with troops and armaments in place in the middle east poised for response. [General Norman Schwarzkopf, Jr.: "We went ahead and did an exercise, what's called a command post exercise, which is what 'Internal Look' was, to test our ability to deal with this particular scenario and also to uncover any command and control problems that might exist, any doctrine problems that might exist between the air force, and the navy and the army forces. And it just so happened that we were in the middle of conducting the "Internal Look Command Post" exercises at the same time that the crisis developed in the Gulf." [Video testimony within the highly regarded film "Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)"]
Aug. 5, 1990 US State Dept. representatives, including General Colin Powell, flew to Saudi Arabia, telling them that the Iraqis were amassing on their borders preparing to invade. Official press releases included the fact that the Saudis were shown satellite photographs proving this buildup. [ABC and the St. Petersburg times revealed January 6, 1991 that commercial satellite photographs obtained from that same period did not show the claimed buildup (58a) - i.e.. the military photos shown to the Saudis were falsified (58b). [See discussion of evidence (58c) , CS Monitor coverage(58d), and video testimony within Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
Aug. 6, 1990 UN Security Council Resolution 661 (59) passed - levying sanctions against Iraq and setting a deadline set of 1/15/91 - i.e.. Martin Luther King, Jr. birthday, for Iraq's withdrawal from Kuwait.
Aug. 7-8, 1990 Saudi Arabia's King Fahd, after being told by US representatives that Iraq was preparing to invade (see Aug. 5, 1990 above) agreed to the basing of US forces on Saudi land (fulfilling a long held US ambition). Over the next 24 hours, without pre-notification of Congress, forty-thousand troops and a cache of military supplies were flown to Saudi Arabia. [See: 60a, 60b, 60c, 60d, and Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
Aug. 8, 1990 Iraq announced the annexation of Kuwait (61).
Aug. 25, 1990 UN Security Council Resolution 665 (62) passed - calling for use of force if Iraq failed to withdraw from Kuwait.
Nov. 8, 1990 US increased forces within the area to 400,000 (mostly in Saudi Arabia). The stationing of US troops on sacred Saudi soil infuriated Osama bin Laden, a wealthy Saudi. [Hidden Wars of Desert Storm (32)]
Nov. 29, 1990 UN Security Council Resolution 678 (63) passed by a vote of 12-2 w/ China abstaining - authorizing the use of force if Iraq failed to withdraw from Kuwait by Jan. 15, 1991. [UN states were pressured by the US to vote for war. Example: Yemen voted against the use of force resolution, following which a US representative was quoted as stating "that will be the most expensive no vote you ever cast." 3 days later, Yemen - the poorest country in the Arab world - had its entire aid budget cut by the US. (64)]
Jan. 12, 1991 US Congress authorized use of force if Iraq hasn't withdrawn from Kuwait, pursuant to UNSC 678, by Jan. 15, 1991 [Joint Res.77 (65), becoming Public Law No: 102-1 on 1/14/91]
Jan. 17, 1991 US lead "Operation Desert Storm" began air assault using "pinpoint accuracy" (only 8% of bombs used were of the -smart- variety, despite mainstream press reports (66)). The bombing resulted in the deaths of 150,000 to 200,000 people, including thousands of innocent civilians. Bombing included reservoirs, filtration and water treatment plants (67a), electric power distribution, food distribution systems. Civilian deaths included 1,500 within the Al-Amariyah shelter. Kuwait entered by coalition forces. (See: Jan. 15, 1991 National Security Directive #54 (67b))
- Keekanoo
by Keekanoo » Sun Jul 04, 2004 8:46 am
And a short blurb about slant oil drilling (or 'directional drilling')
From Wikipidia on line encyclopedia
Directional drilling (sometimes known as slant drilling outside the oil industry) is a method used in oil drilling for exploration and extraction of crude oil, where the direction of the drill string is forced out of an essential vertical direction. In modern petroleum engineering, especially in off-shore operations, directional drilling has become the norm rather than the exception, and the path of the drill can be controlled with great precision, and be extended horizontally only limited by the total length of the drill string.
Since slant drilling is very difficult to trace for outsiders of the operation, the technique has frequently been used to steal oil resources from neighbouring oil fields. Several cases are known, the one with the most spectacular consequences being slant drilling performed by Kuwait. This was one of the reasons given by Iraq for invading that country in 1991 (see Gulf War).
From Wikipidia on line encyclopedia
Directional drilling (sometimes known as slant drilling outside the oil industry) is a method used in oil drilling for exploration and extraction of crude oil, where the direction of the drill string is forced out of an essential vertical direction. In modern petroleum engineering, especially in off-shore operations, directional drilling has become the norm rather than the exception, and the path of the drill can be controlled with great precision, and be extended horizontally only limited by the total length of the drill string.
Since slant drilling is very difficult to trace for outsiders of the operation, the technique has frequently been used to steal oil resources from neighbouring oil fields. Several cases are known, the one with the most spectacular consequences being slant drilling performed by Kuwait. This was one of the reasons given by Iraq for invading that country in 1991 (see Gulf War).
- Keekanoo
by Keekanoo » Sun Jul 04, 2004 8:57 am
And Levar... I live about 60 miles from the US border. Not exactly a world away. Germs, nukes, power-outages etc definatley have the prospect of hitting me. So yah know? I kind of feel part of the actions taken by powerful forces in America.
And lets get something straight for the record. 'You' didn't invade Iraq because of 'WMD'... Key forces within the big business decided it was high time to whip Saddam back in shape and use the attack as a pretext to establishing military bases to A., secure the regions wealth and B., gain a tighter perimeter area on The Nasty Evil Empire of Russia (long since fallen out of the picture but kept around as a boogeyman to inflame the fear of the ever-willing public to pay massive taxes to support the 'war effort' and calmly send their sons and daughters off to death to 'Stop the Evil Communist Expansion').
Too, don't look at me, the Kook, the Canuck, that wacko communist fanatic as an opposer to 'your' fiendishly astute perceptions of world events, nay, look to the fact that more than 50% of 'your' very own Americans are currently against this 'liberation' of Iraq.
I'm not here to hate. I like Americans. Lot of color and culture. Hugely productive country that HAS helped in many ways around the planet. However, I am not going to sit idly by and watch soap-box charletons beseach sage wisdom about things they really know very little about.
It is unfortunate, but predictable, that individuals will so readily gobble up the propoganda spoon-fed them. I certainly do not think all Americans are like some of the select few here. Hopefully more of the 'other' side will speak to balance out the extremists I see spamming these threads with absurd claims.
Keek.
And lets get something straight for the record. 'You' didn't invade Iraq because of 'WMD'... Key forces within the big business decided it was high time to whip Saddam back in shape and use the attack as a pretext to establishing military bases to A., secure the regions wealth and B., gain a tighter perimeter area on The Nasty Evil Empire of Russia (long since fallen out of the picture but kept around as a boogeyman to inflame the fear of the ever-willing public to pay massive taxes to support the 'war effort' and calmly send their sons and daughters off to death to 'Stop the Evil Communist Expansion').
Too, don't look at me, the Kook, the Canuck, that wacko communist fanatic as an opposer to 'your' fiendishly astute perceptions of world events, nay, look to the fact that more than 50% of 'your' very own Americans are currently against this 'liberation' of Iraq.
I'm not here to hate. I like Americans. Lot of color and culture. Hugely productive country that HAS helped in many ways around the planet. However, I am not going to sit idly by and watch soap-box charletons beseach sage wisdom about things they really know very little about.
It is unfortunate, but predictable, that individuals will so readily gobble up the propoganda spoon-fed them. I certainly do not think all Americans are like some of the select few here. Hopefully more of the 'other' side will speak to balance out the extremists I see spamming these threads with absurd claims.
Keek.
by Savant » Sun Jul 04, 2004 10:32 am
Hey Beo were not like that, speak your mind man.
Keek has his views as does Ingus and others.
but you gotta question how/why the support this nation had after 9-11 from around the world so quickly vanished
And N.Korea? you are right a no win situation, with 1-2 nukes, biological agents (which they have huge amounts) they simply could sell them to the highest bidder with no qualms, that is if we dont pay them off to keep em fueled and fed for a few more yrs.
Keek has his views as does Ingus and others.
but you gotta question how/why the support this nation had after 9-11 from around the world so quickly vanished
And N.Korea? you are right a no win situation, with 1-2 nukes, biological agents (which they have huge amounts) they simply could sell them to the highest bidder with no qualms, that is if we dont pay them off to keep em fueled and fed for a few more yrs.
Sal_Monella
- Major SONAR
- Posts: 496
- Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 12:18 pm
- Location: Nashville, TN
by Major SONAR » Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:38 pm
By the way, the slant-oil drilling apparatus used by Kuwait to siphon oil from within the Iraq borders was purchased and supplied, in large, by U.S. industries.
Another FANATICAL delusion... Total BS propoganda... only Ultra Left Wing Liberals acutally believe this! It's bullcrap like this that clogs up the internet.
Another Awesome Sig by Evan - Thanks man!
- Keekanoo
by Keekanoo » Sun Jul 04, 2004 7:04 pm
Major Sonar, I admire your patriotism. All I ask is that you do some reading. Do google-searches on any of the info I've related here. Spend a few weeks puzzling through grossly conflicting info. Start the processing guffawing at these 'radical fanatical conspiracy theories' by all means. Just do the reading. Coming in here and frothing at the mouth is great drama, and would have stood you well 14,000 years ago jumping out from behind some log but today we try to use the front part of our grey-matter, not just the aft, or lizard section.
Here is the gentleman who owned the Company which sold the slant drilling equipment to the Kuwaiti's. You might recognize his name. Included are hyper links (they might not work but the addresses are usesable).
Scowcroft served as National Security Advisor to both Presidents Gerald R. Ford and George Herbert Walker Bush. He was Vice Chairman of Kissinger Associates, Inc. (1982-1989), an international consulting firm. "In this capacity, he advised and assisted a wide range of U.S. and foreign corporate leaders on global joint venture opportunities, strategic planning and risk assessment."[3]
And now... the amazing pyrotechnic flash of smoke and mirros swept aside....
______________________
1987 – As the Iran-Iraq War drew near an end, Kuwait moved its border 90 miles north, annexing approximately 900 square miles of the Rumailah oil field in southern Iraq. In this newly-acquired territory, the Sante Fe Drilling Co., a U.S. company whose board chair was Brent Scowcroft (national security adviser under Presidents Gerald Ford and George H.W. Bush), began slant drilling into the 95% of the Rumailah oil field still lying within Iraq. This was one of the important reasons behind Iraq's August 1990 invasion of Kuwait. Iraq accused the American-Kuwaiti oil companies of sub-terranean slant drilling on the border, and hence extracting oil from the oil Iraqi side of the border.
_______________________
Scowcroft's prior 29-year "military career began with graduation from West Point and concluded at the rank of Lieutenant General following service as the Deputy National Security Advisor. His Air Force service included Professor of Russian History at West Point; Assistant Air Attache in Belgrade, Yugoslavia; Head of the Political Science Department at the Air Force Academy; Air Force Long Range Plans, Office of the Secretary of Defense International Security Assistance, Special Assistant to the Director of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and Military Assistant to President Richard M. Nixon. Out of uniform he continued in a public policy capacity by serving on the President's Advisory Committee on Arms Control, the Commission on Strategic Forces and the President's Special Review Board, also known as the Tower Board." He is also tied to the Iran/Contra scandal. [4]
He earned his B.S. degree from West Point and M.A. and Ph.D. degrees in International Relations from Columbia University.[5][6]
And for those that still have a stomach to sift through info, here is some more, all verifiable.
"'...
verifiable by a simple google search. Here are some things that have been proven correct about the 1st Gulf War
1. The US LIED about Iraqi attrocities, the now famous baby incubator story. Go here: http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0906/p25s02-cogn.htm 2. The US LIED about Iraqi troops threatening to invade Saudi Arabia. Go here: http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0906/p01s02-wosc.htm 3. April Gallespie DID mislead Saddam Hussien into believing that the US will not attack Iraq if Iraq invaded Kuwait. Here is her exact quote: "We have no opinion on your Arab-Arab conflicts, such as your dispute with Kuwait. Secretary [of State James] Baker has directed me to emphasize the instruction that Kuwait is not associated with America." What else do you need? She is telling him outright that the Secretary of State is behind these words. 4. The US LIED about Iraq gassing the Kurds. Read this: http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/31/opinion/31PELL.html? ex=1045026775&ei=1&en=8b68bcf4d430d35a The person who wrote this article was the head of the CIA desk in charge of monitoring the Iran- Iraq War ...'"
I'm afraid you won't find any conspiracy theories here. You'll only find verifiable facts through further google searches. I'm sorry to burst the bubble of the more militant fanatics that froth at the mouth in here.
Keek.
Here is the gentleman who owned the Company which sold the slant drilling equipment to the Kuwaiti's. You might recognize his name. Included are hyper links (they might not work but the addresses are usesable).
Scowcroft served as National Security Advisor to both Presidents Gerald R. Ford and George Herbert Walker Bush. He was Vice Chairman of Kissinger Associates, Inc. (1982-1989), an international consulting firm. "In this capacity, he advised and assisted a wide range of U.S. and foreign corporate leaders on global joint venture opportunities, strategic planning and risk assessment."[3]
And now... the amazing pyrotechnic flash of smoke and mirros swept aside....
______________________
1987 – As the Iran-Iraq War drew near an end, Kuwait moved its border 90 miles north, annexing approximately 900 square miles of the Rumailah oil field in southern Iraq. In this newly-acquired territory, the Sante Fe Drilling Co., a U.S. company whose board chair was Brent Scowcroft (national security adviser under Presidents Gerald Ford and George H.W. Bush), began slant drilling into the 95% of the Rumailah oil field still lying within Iraq. This was one of the important reasons behind Iraq's August 1990 invasion of Kuwait. Iraq accused the American-Kuwaiti oil companies of sub-terranean slant drilling on the border, and hence extracting oil from the oil Iraqi side of the border.
_______________________
Scowcroft's prior 29-year "military career began with graduation from West Point and concluded at the rank of Lieutenant General following service as the Deputy National Security Advisor. His Air Force service included Professor of Russian History at West Point; Assistant Air Attache in Belgrade, Yugoslavia; Head of the Political Science Department at the Air Force Academy; Air Force Long Range Plans, Office of the Secretary of Defense International Security Assistance, Special Assistant to the Director of the Joint Chiefs of Staff and Military Assistant to President Richard M. Nixon. Out of uniform he continued in a public policy capacity by serving on the President's Advisory Committee on Arms Control, the Commission on Strategic Forces and the President's Special Review Board, also known as the Tower Board." He is also tied to the Iran/Contra scandal. [4]
He earned his B.S. degree from West Point and M.A. and Ph.D. degrees in International Relations from Columbia University.[5][6]
And for those that still have a stomach to sift through info, here is some more, all verifiable.
"'...
verifiable by a simple google search. Here are some things that have been proven correct about the 1st Gulf War
1. The US LIED about Iraqi attrocities, the now famous baby incubator story. Go here: http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0906/p25s02-cogn.htm 2. The US LIED about Iraqi troops threatening to invade Saudi Arabia. Go here: http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0906/p01s02-wosc.htm 3. April Gallespie DID mislead Saddam Hussien into believing that the US will not attack Iraq if Iraq invaded Kuwait. Here is her exact quote: "We have no opinion on your Arab-Arab conflicts, such as your dispute with Kuwait. Secretary [of State James] Baker has directed me to emphasize the instruction that Kuwait is not associated with America." What else do you need? She is telling him outright that the Secretary of State is behind these words. 4. The US LIED about Iraq gassing the Kurds. Read this: http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/31/opinion/31PELL.html? ex=1045026775&ei=1&en=8b68bcf4d430d35a The person who wrote this article was the head of the CIA desk in charge of monitoring the Iran- Iraq War ...'"
I'm afraid you won't find any conspiracy theories here. You'll only find verifiable facts through further google searches. I'm sorry to burst the bubble of the more militant fanatics that froth at the mouth in here.
Keek.
- Sewer-Urchin
by Sewer-Urchin » Sun Jul 04, 2004 7:15 pm
Hmm...can't read about how Saddam didn't gas the Kurds cause I don't feel like registering w/ the NY Times. I am curious how they managed to get such realistic looking bodies, as well as the mutilated survivors that are well documented. Also, it should be noted that the Times doesn't have the most stellar record of truth-telling of late.
- Keekanoo
by Keekanoo » Sun Jul 04, 2004 7:33 pm
Although I'm not an expert, from what I gather it was actually the Iranians who gassed the Kurds. But I dunno... Nothing would surprise me. Contrary to popular belief, I don't support either Saddam or his Bah'hast regime (sp?). And considering the evidance available revealing how the U.S. sold lots of bio's to Iraq, I wouldn't be surprised if Saddam or his son (as the popular press gives it) had a hand in it.
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