Hurricane Rita !!

by **cavalierlwt** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 4:25 pm

I essentially agree with you. The problem with oil (besides pollution) is that it comes primarily from countries that hate us, and on top of it, we will soon be competing with India and China for it. Energy is now the base of modern life, and to be in a situation like we are is crazy. It is probably the biggest factor in whether our economy flourishes or crashes. So, let's take our most important commodity and put it in our own hands. Push comes to shove, there is just no upside to oil. It used to be cheap, that's about it. Everything else is a downside, the politics, the economics, the pollution etc.

I've kinda posted on this before, but there's three groups of thought that hold us back:
The first group is people who are waiting for the scientific breakthrough that solves all our problems in one shot, the magic bullet.
The second group are the one's that hate modern society, are in love with the idea of living like 'hobbits', not realizing the truth about how bad life was in pre-Industrial times.
The third are just pessimists, think it's too hard, too expensive.

My point of view is, the switch to a different energy supply is going to be a financial boom, ten times bigger than the advent of computers. Just the act of converting is going to create so much wealth, never mind the possibilities afterwards.

As for the Kyota accords, I have no idea why the hell they don't want to fully include China and India in the treaty. Whats the point of the West reducing greenhouse gas output if India and China wind up polluting at a rate 5 times that of the Western world.

by **cavalierlwt** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 4:30 pm

I should have added, I do believe in Global Warming, I just don't know that it adds up to something minor, or something catastrophic. But as for going off half-cocked, I don't think we need to rip apart our lifestyle, but also don't want us to sit on our ass for the next 20 years doing nothing. I think we're a pretty smart bunch o' monkeys, and can have our cake and eat it too if we would just get off our ass.

by **Starlite** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 5:16 pm

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=181

Here is a good article about global warming and its connection to hurricanes. If there is at all...it's pretty interesting.

In the same manner, while we cannot draw firm conclusions about one single hurricane, we can draw some conclusions about hurricanes more generally. In particular, the available scientific evidence indicates that it is likely that global warming will make - and possibly already is making - those hurricanes that form more destructive than they otherwise would have been.

Scenarios for future global warming show tropical SST rising by a few degrees, not just tenths of a degree (see e.g. results from the Hadley Centre model and the implications for hurricanes shown in Fig. 1 above). That is the important message from science. What we need to discuss is not what caused Katrina, but the likelyhood that global warming will make hurricanes even worse in future.

by **Colonel Ingus** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 5:19 pm

Originally posted by cavalierlwt
I should have added, I do believe in Global Warming, I just don't know that it adds up to something minor, or something catastrophic. But as for going off half-cocked, I don't think we need to rip apart our lifestyle, but also don't want us to sit on our ass for the next 20 years doing nothing. I think we're a pretty smart bunch o' monkeys, and can have our cake and eat it too if we would just get off our ass.

Solid Cavalier solid.

I totally agree with your sentiments. Quit screwing around and Git'er done!

We solve problems thru technology, not by giving up technology. Let's improve, not regress. I just don't need scare tactics based upon poor science to make me want it. I want it for its own sake.

I would, however, like to submit that Global Warming occuring on the planet Mars cannot possibly be linked to any environmental factors local to the planet Earth and so does cast doubt upon certain aspects of terrestrial "global warming" causes.

But the Earth and Mars do share one thing in common.

Wether or not the causes for global warming espoused are true or not really doesn't matter. Who wants pollution lying around? Who wants to pay 3, 4, 5 bucks a gallon as oil prices increase? Again I don't need scare tactics based on questionable science to make me think that way.

by **Chacal** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 5:38 pm

Amen.

I want to breathe clean air, not toxic products. I don't mind "ripping apart our life-style" though. Frankly, there's nothing in our life-style much worth saving.

I want clean air NOW. If it means closing factories and scrapping SUVs and economic turmoil, well, tough. We'll get through.

Anyway, at our present rate of industrialization and population growth, we can't keep the same ecological footprint for long.

by **deathBOB** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 5:52 pm

Unfortunately the people who profit the most from oil are currently in power.

Who else is looking forward to the next election?

Anyways, the thing that scares me the most about global warming is thermal expansion of the oceans. Most of the people on ear live next to or near an ocean. Even a rise of a few feet could be catastrophic. Think NOx1,000,000.

by **Colonel Ingus** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 5:53 pm

Chacal the ideal program, from my own humble viewpoint of course, is massive expansion of technology to make space accessible.

Fusion power and fuel cells are integral parts of that. They can also meet of needs for tranportation (electrical and fuel cell) and provide for all our energy needs.

Once we get into space we move all our manufacturing into orbit and turn our "home" into one gigantic friggin park!

Products like medicines, metals, crystals and such have already been shown to be a higher quality product in orbit. It's just to expensive right now and we are wasting money instead of developing neccesary technologies.

But I suspect you are a liberal (and socialist) and are more offended by someone owning a SUV than by any effect it has on the environment.

by **pressure** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 7:38 pm

Good luck for all you people that have Hurricane Rita coming your way. Isn't it ironic how Katrina and Rita sound similar? Lol they must have planned this!

by **Sabres** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 7:47 pm

Take 4 letters out of Katrina and you can make Rita!

wow i'm good...

by **Allister Fiend** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 8:34 pm

Originally posted by deathBOB
Unfortunately the people who profit the most from oil are currently in power.

Who else is looking forward to the next election?

Anyways, the thing that scares me the most about global warming is thermal expansion of the oceans. Most of the people on ear live next to or near an ocean. Even a rise of a few feet could be catastrophic. Think NOx1,000,000.

All politicians profit from one thing or the other, Our last election had one of the richest candidates ever and he was the one who did not win. do you really think they are looking out for your best interest, they are all rich whether or not the money comes from big business or environmentalist groups or organizations (or marriage

). It does not matter what party they are in, you just have to vote for the person you think will screw you the least.

And on another note, we have been having global warming ever since the end of the last ice age. It is nothing new, just a cycle that this earth has been going through for millions of years.

Same goes for the hurricanes, it's been about 40 years since the last cycle.

Allister Fiend

by **deathBOB** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 8:48 pm

Originally posted by Colonel Ingus
Chacal the ideal program, from my own humble viewpoint of course, is massive expansion of technology to make space accessible.

Fusion power and fuel cells are integral parts of that. They can also meet of needs for tranportation (electrical and fuel cell) and provide for all our energy needs.

Once we get into space we move all our manufacturing into orbit and turn our "home" into one gigantic friggin park!

Products like medicines, metals, crystals and such have already been shown to be a higher quality product in orbit. It's just to expensive right now and we are wasting money instead of developing neccesary technologies.

But I suspect you are a liberal (and socialist) and are more offended by someone owning a SUV than by any effect it has on the environment.

Soon Ingus soon... Look at the rapid commericalization of space travel that is taking place. It is no longer just the playground of the big contractors.

Hopefully stuff like this will happen in yours or my lifetime.

by **syribo** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:08 pm

All the big words are scaring me more than this talk of catastrophe's :'(

by **pressure** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:36 pm

Lol, they are super nerds that will someday build a device for everybody to wear pocketdetectors.

by **Chacal** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 11:09 pm

Originally posted by Colonel Ingus

But I suspect you are a liberal (and socialist) and are more offended by someone owning a SUV than by any effect it has on the environment.

Both in equal parts, actually.

by **Killer Mike** » Fri Sep 23, 2005 11:34 pm

Originally posted by pressure
Lol, they are super nerds that will someday build a device for everybody to wear pocketdetectors.

Pocket-Protectors?

Hurricane Rita !!

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